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Control Box: Are Dolan aluminium track frames shit?

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      CommentAuthorIron Eye
    • CommentTimeMay 8th 2008 edited
     
    I've heard they break... I've even seen a broken, re-welded one in Manchester. Common sense tells me not to buy one

    but... they're £120, my frame might be cracked, and I am pretty skint... so... anyone here got one, or know if they're any shitter than Pearson fixed frames...

    • CommentAuthorsleepy
    • CommentTimeMay 8th 2008
     
    depends on size, the bigger the frame, the worse their rep for breakage.
    •  
      CommentAuthorIron Eye
    • CommentTimeMay 8th 2008
     
    58mm, so... avoid eh?
    •  
      CommentAuthorJosh
    • CommentTimeMay 8th 2008
     
    I've been riding a 58 dolan like that for about 6 or 8 months and its fine, slightly older version without internal headset. I ride it quite hard up and down kerbs and with a front brake for endos, rides quite nicely, bit ship like for me as I normally ride 54-5 (fits fine with flat bars)

    Having said all that I'm trading it in in a week or two for something steel and tougher, hope it doesn't break in the meantime.
    •  
      CommentAuthorchandra
    • CommentTimeMay 8th 2008
     
    I cracked mine by going at a decent pace straight into a curb. Much happier with the steel number now.
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      CommentAuthorThe.Pike
    • CommentTimeMay 8th 2008
     
    ive cracked up!
  7.  
    where is the crack in your current frame? what frame is it?
    •  
      CommentAuthorIron Eye
    • CommentTimeMay 9th 2008 edited
     
    Pearson Touche

    Not 100% sure if the frame's cracked, but the paint around the weld by the BB/seatttube is cracked, so I think the actual frame might be cracked there... of course it could be just BB flex that has caused the paint to crack...
  9.  
    "of course it could be just BB flex that has caused the paint to crack..."

    That sounds unlikely. It's probably a crack.
    •  
      CommentAuthorIron Eye
    • CommentTimeMay 9th 2008
     
    I wish it was some crack :-(
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      CommentAuthorzero cc
    • CommentTimeMay 10th 2008
     
    The cracked Dolan you saw in MCR belonged to Luke - he's been through three of those frames. Luke is a bleedin' animal who should be riding something made of gaspipe - someone of normal build & strength (like yourself) shouldn't have a problem. On the other hand, why risk it? Get some steel.
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      CommentAuthorGertie
    • CommentTimeMay 11th 2008
     
    you really riding a 58 MM frame? if so I don't think you have to worry about it flexing enough to break though you might have problems fitting the wheels in!
    Nixon ( for those of you with long memories) once retired a frame thinking it was cracked there, later took a bit of emery paper to it and found it was only the paint. try sanding it down a little to see if the crack does run deeper than the paint?
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      CommentAuthorIron Eye
    • CommentTimeMay 12th 2008 edited
     
    Hahahahahaha! thanks for pointing that out! Yeah I'm actually a tiny pixie, I'm 10 times smaller than a human being. It's a bastard trying to find 70c x 2.3 tubes :-(

    I will sand down tonight...
    •  
      CommentAuthorIron Eye
    • CommentTimeJul 22nd 2008
     
    OK, so I completely forgot that my frame is cracked. The crack was definitely a crack, and it spread - it now covers almost the entire circumference of the seat tube. Bollocks!

    I'm thinking of getting a steel frame but ain't sure what to go for... and I will of course need new forks and headset.... balls!
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      CommentAuthorwill
    • CommentTimeJul 22nd 2008
     
    Are you forgetting the cardboard option Iron?
    • CommentAuthorJP
    • CommentTimeJul 22nd 2008 edited
     
    "it now covers almost the entire circumference of the seat tube"


    Bandage it with a flattened stella can and jubilee clip it up... Keep it goin for a while... :)

    (Oooops, just reread and noticed the location of the crack. If it was higher up...)
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      CommentAuthorIron Eye
    • CommentTimeJul 22nd 2008
     
    *cries*

    I am stupid for continuing to ride it, but there's not much else I do until I get a spare bike

    I wonder if it'll snap while i'm riding it...
  18.  
    As the queen of bad choices when it comes to frames (see wooden frame, 1960's pearson that's too big for me and 1960's jack taylor that's super rare) I'm going to pass on some advice the I didn't take.

    Buy and IRO. They're cheap, steel, and fairly nice.
    •  
      CommentAuthorIron Eye
    • CommentTimeJul 22nd 2008
     
    i might end up having to buy an old man's pearson, same as mine but the right size for me (mine is slightly too long). he bought it on impulse after he saw mine, and he's hardly used it.

    bonus info: he's about 77 years old and he's about as fast as me, but he looks very, very old.
    •  
      CommentAuthorsteff
    • CommentTimeJul 23rd 2008
     
    Keep an eye on eBay - there are usually some old steel road/track frames on there. Were it not for potential wrath of girlfriend I might well have had this, for instance: http://cgi.ebay.co.uk/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&ssPageName=STRK:MEWAX:IT&item=150269135585
    There's a 531 Raleigh Gran Sport on there for £32 with a day to go, for instance.
  21.  
    Steff, that's a good idea if your not going to be riding that hard, or if you want to potentialy end up buying something that's a moment away from being cracked. There is nothing worse than replacing a only vaugly rideable frame with another only vaugly rideable frame. I should know.

    If I end up having to glue in another head set or ad a brass shim as a spacer, I might just buy one of these- http://unipackuk.co.uk/track-bikes_roadcourier.html
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      CommentAuthorwill
    • CommentTimeJul 23rd 2008
     
    I started couriering in 92 on a Raleigh Gran Sport. ah happy memories. it was finally wrecked by a pot hole on camden rd.
    •  
      CommentAuthorIron Eye
    • CommentTimeJul 23rd 2008
     
    I am a lucky bastard. Guy at bike shop phones the guy who supplies the pearson frames to him. Supplier agrees straight away to replace the frame, free of charge. Supplier is miles away and bike shop man can't pick up frame til next week. BUT! One of our van courieris is driving past the supplier in about an hour. My frame is in my hand within 2 hours of me going to the bike shop. Sweet!!!
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      CommentAuthorstupidP
    • CommentTimeJul 23rd 2008
     
    All Track frames are shit, oh and the police do a great job. 5'O over and out>
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      CommentAuthorsteff
    • CommentTimeJul 24th 2008
     
    Nhatt - point taken, and as a non-messengerer I'm neither particularly strong nor doing the sort of mileage you lot do. However, having spent some time around a lugged steel frame in process of construction (Dave Yates course - my frame was fillet brazed aside from the BB, but the other fella was doing a fully lugged frame) I do have a good deal of confidence in it as a means of producing long-lived frames. Just as importantly, I have a very very strong suspicion that when a lugged steel frame does fail it'll tend to do so a good deal more gracefully and slowly than TIGed aluminium - cracks don't propagate as fast in steel AFAIK and the lugs spread the stress around a good deal.
  26.  
    TIG welding isn't really the reason why aluminium snaps like it does, It's to do with the elastic (or lack of) etc properties of the metal, although that said cheap and quick welding is not going to help the integrity of the tubes in the first place.

    Most mass produced contemporary steel frames are TIGed, IRO, Surly etc.

    I've snapped two steel frames (both brazed) and never snapped an aluminium frame.
    Just the way the cookie crumbles.

    For 28 quid that geof butler isn't really that bad.
    Sure 501 isn't all that cool, but it is equal to a lot of the cromoly that some steel bikes now are made of.
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      CommentAuthorsteff
    • CommentTimeJul 24th 2008 edited
     
    Aye, I should really have specified "TIG welding under huge time pressure" which I think probably best describes the production process for the lower-end stuff - Surly, IRO and friends strike me as a level or two above that, and clearly there's nothing intrinsically wrong with the process given that Pegoretti, Independent Fabrication et al use it. It doesn't offer any margin for error if not done well, though. Out of interest, where/how did your steel frames go?
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      CommentAuthorselim
    • CommentTimeJul 24th 2008
     
    I found [url=http://www.ribblecycles.co.uk/ProductDetail.asp?ProductID=897&CatID=105]this[/url] if you're still looking for that Dolan frame but it looks like it ends tonight. And they only seem to have small frames left.

    Anyone know where I can nab a decent track frame for about £150? My beater is dying and I think it's time I went for a proper frame instead of converting old frames that seem to fall apart.
    • CommentAuthorsleepy
    • CommentTimeJul 25th 2008
     
    "TIG welding isn't really the reason why aluminium snaps like it does, It's to do with the elastic (or lack of) etc properties of the metal, although that said cheap and quick welding is not going to help the integrity of the tubes in the first place."

    the heat from welding makes the aluminium more brittle and likely to crack, if it's welded on the cheap by someone who doesn't know what they're doing then the heat affected area* will be larger and the likelihood of failure is increased. Dolan's alu track frames have an appalling reputation for failure, fortunately they also seem to have a decent warranty department.

    *technical term innit.
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      CommentAuthornanu
    • CommentTimeJul 25th 2008
     
    "technical term innit" If you want to be REALLY speccy, the correct term is HAZ, or heat affected zone. This phenomenon can affect all welds, but is particularly common in aluminium. It is characterized by a microscopic hairline fracture which appears down the centre of the weld soon after manufacture and is caused by inevitable rapid contraction of the cooling joint. Structures which are to be subjected to complex loads are sometimes checked with a non destructive testing method like penetrative dyes or x-raying, somehow I suspect that Dolan use neither. Smartypants methods of preventing this cracking invariably attempt to control the rate of cooling (F1 car buliders use special ovens), a process which is often unwieldy and very costly, hence the reason it is not usually done. Working with aluminium is pure Evil, and is often seen by professional welders as the true test of ability.
    • CommentAuthorsleepy
    • CommentTimeJul 25th 2008
     
    :shades:

    thought that might lure you out. :wink:
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      CommentAuthornanu
    • CommentTimeJul 25th 2008
     
    Ay up lad.

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