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Control Box: it's like if they steal your beloved costum built bike....

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      CommentAuthorlisa
    • CommentTimeFeb 19th 2011
     
    ....if they use your work without crediting properly.

    so i see the 20 odd questions, fun, i love it. in fact, i'm sorry -not really!- but really reminds me of the Q&A i did for my book, see here http://issuu.com/lisaphoto/docs/dontshootthemessenger. ok different questions, but hey, the idea is the same and it was mine.
    not big deal i think, leave it.
    few days later i come across the feature about the LCEF in Landscape Magazine. Great, the fantastic LCEF gets visibility in the continent and 2 of my pictures go with the article. It seems like they put some credits so i zoom in as i wasn t even expecting it. and there you go, "photography:LCEF".
    a wrong credit is way worst than a missing one, really makes you thinking "WTF you're taking the piss?!?!"

    now, these 2 things together within the same week really upset me.
    if you think i'm fussy and difficult fine, but it's a fact i've always been and i am more than happy for the LCEF or movingtarget to use my stuff, it's flattering and makes me feel really honoured.
    still....it's my work and all i 'd expect is for that to be mentioned.

    just as i said, you see someone stealing your bike, what would you do, sit and think whatever, or run behind it and get it back?
    there.

    lisa
    • CommentAuthorselimski
    • CommentTimeFeb 19th 2011
     
    Wrote to the editor of Landscape yet?

    If they knowingly used your pics without your knowledge you could invoice them for it.
    I know that the Association Of Photographers has got very good lawyers that do advice on this kinda stuff. Usually you have to be a member of AOP, but its worth asking for advice.

    If, on other hand, they've been supplied with your photos by someone who took the credit for your work then...well that is theft.

    Get in touch with Landscape with links to your website etc. In the worst case you should get the credits corrected on their online archive.
  3.  
    i didnt get a photo credit for seamouse 20 questions , its koolbeans tho :)
    • CommentAuthorselimski
    • CommentTimeFeb 19th 2011
     
    I can only speak for myself.

    And what I think is this:

    If a photographer is being kindly asked if their work can be used on a website/ in a publication and they don't care about credit, thats fine.

    But in situation where photographer's work not only is being used without their permission, but also is being credited to someone else...

    By no means I am a copy rights law expert, but from what I know that would fall into the category of theft.
    Lisa has got good reason to be pissed off!
  5.  
    I sympathise with you as I've had photos that took a considerable amount of effort to make, used without permission by some cheeky, lazy prick who couldn't be arsed to make that kind of effort. But your analogy is bollocks. If someone 'steals' your photos they're not physically taking anything from you and they're not stopping you from being in posession of something, so it's nothing like them stealing your bike...

    My advice would be not to go in guns blazing as tghe people who used it might have done so in good faith. I gave someone at the BBC a right bollocking and threatened legal action only to be told that they'd not taken the photo without permission, they'd been supplied with it by someone who told them they owned the copyright to it. They removed the photo immediately but I felt like a right muppet for assuming they'd just taken it. So whatever you do, be polite and find out how and why they have used the photo before you send in the men with sledgehammers...
    • CommentAuthorselimski
    • CommentTimeFeb 19th 2011 edited
     
    BRITISH COPY RIGHT LAW (http://www.copyrightservice.co.uk/protect/p16_photography_copyright):

    "As with all copyright work, you should first obtain permission from the copyright owner before you use someone else’s work.
    You should also be prepared to pay a fee, as many photographers will charge you for using their work.
    Only the copyright owner, (or his/her authorised representative), can give permission, so you should contact the photographer, or his/her company, directly for consent.
    For images published on the Internet, it is typical to contact the webmaster of the site in the first instance, unless the site provides contact details for the owner of the images.
    The copyright owner has no obligation to allow you to use their work, and can refuse permission for any reason."

    Next time BBC steals your picture contact a lawyer. Woman from AOP told me that BBC is near the top on their list of worst copy right offenders.
  7.  
    ""XX DIABOLIC XX gave us perhaps the quote of 2010 in this thread:

    "I bet you weren't born with a fucking bike between your legs as your mum spread hers in order to give us the honour of your presence"

    Now thats a fucking T Shirt slogan. Av that arrogant couriers (the ones that dont say wassup on the road when I try to be all WAHEYYYY!! in passing) and av that fakengers with more Aerospoke than quick poke on Clerkenwell Rd. Come on Pistard, I'll buy one, if I dont already print my own up (of course with DIABOLIC's name underneath - credit where credits due dude) ""(Charlie Roadkill)

    credit where credits due...................bottom line, end of.

    Chin up Lisa... XX:devil:
    •  
      CommentAuthorlisa
    • CommentTimeFeb 19th 2011
     
    @selim
    thanks!
    landscape magazine people are without fault as they've been provided the wrong information.
    they're cool and very kind and will make a note and link to my thing in their website/facebook page.
    @robnoxious666
    a number of my pictures has been used here and on the LCEF website, never asked/wanted/expect to be credited as "in between friends" i don't care about it, it's totally cool and nice. but then, in the case of an online and printed magazine, fairly well distributed and which seems to be doing well in its own niche, yes i do care.
    also, the similarity i'm referring to about the 20 questions bothers me because mine are part of a project i worked on for months,i've been promoting and trying to get funding etcetc...it was/is hard work, just that.
    @bread pedaler
    as said above, yes i did check with the magazine, politely off course, only pointed out the mistake. then i understood what happened... they've been really understanding and helpful, and will do what they can.
    the problem came from london, therefore my rant above. as simple as that.

    the analogy with the bike was for giving an idea of the feeling you have when you watch this happening. your bike is your property, so is my work for me...intellectual property?!

    anyway, i'm not sending man with sledgehammers to anyone, i'm the first one putting my stuff online and you get this a lot.but seeing it happening twice, in a week or so, in within the same context.....i had to point it out. end of story.
  9.  
    @selimski

    " Women from AOP told me that BBC is near the top on their list of worst copy right offenders."

    I know - I've heard that from other photographers too. That's why I made the assumption that they'd simply nicked it off my flickr page

    @lisa - sorry - must have not read your post properly. I still think it's a crap analogy though. Taking my bike stops me from travelling around by bike, stops me from training and stops me from racing. It means I have to find £1000 from somewhere to replace it. If I was still a courier it would stop me from paying my rent. When someone used my photo without permission it didn't stop me from doing anything, it didn't hurt me financially or restrict my freedom - the only damage it did was to my ego.

    ...but that's off topic really, so I hereby STFU.
    • CommentAuthorselimski
    • CommentTimeFeb 19th 2011
     
    Just re-read the thread and realized that at times I did sound a bit harsh and pointing an accusatory finger.

    My fault for not allowing the benefit of the doubt.

    I do feel rather strongly about the issue hence my comments.

    Hope that no one felt offended.
    • CommentAuthorJP
    • CommentTimeFeb 19th 2011 edited
     
    I agree with the point about using your photos, that is taking the piss if you havent granted permission. But re. the 20 questions you are certainly not the first and it wasnt your idea. Cant find the website now ( think it has disappeared) but there was a page a few years back of profiles of london couriers with pics and taped interviews. As i remember it was an unfunded project by a courier for couriers.

    Anyone got a link if it still exists? (It used to be linked on MT)
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      CommentAuthorcurly
    • CommentTimeFeb 19th 2011
     
    Selimski are you a genius your use of the English languge is great, better than mine ive had 42 years to practise.And Dazzler why not the next 20 question on Selimski
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      CommentAuthorcurly
    • CommentTimeFeb 19th 2011
     
    photo thieves are evil
    • CommentAuthorselimski
    • CommentTimeFeb 20th 2011
     
    Next 20 questions on Curly please.
  15.  
    @ JP I remember that! But can't remember who he was! Helmet, posh accent,wore a motobike chain lock around his neck (in the dead cold), a little eccentric, friendly beyong the imagination. And yes, there was a web site with our mugshots. *sigh* :neutral:
    • CommentAuthorselimski
    • CommentTimeFeb 20th 2011
     
    Slightly crazy 04 Dave from Churchills. He used to live somewhere around Dulwich I think.
    Last time seen on the road about 6-7 years ago...
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      CommentAuthorcurly
    • CommentTimeFeb 20th 2011 edited
     
    Selimski much missed i wearing your T-shirt with pride
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      CommentAuthorcurly
    • CommentTimeFeb 20th 2011
     
    im going to be back in october see you at Creative courner
    • CommentAuthordazzler
    • CommentTimeFeb 21st 2011
     
    Actually the idea for the 20 Questions came from Emily where she wrote in her piece about 'recognition' back in September..

    "And of course there’s this august site, the first stop for anyone looking to learn about London cycle couriers. So I propose a series of articles, profiling the legends of the London courier scene. And by that I don’t mean the drunkest, the loudest or the stupidest (though they’re all worthy accolades too). I mean the people who show you how it ought to be done. The women and men who’ve been on the road for years, who are fast, efficient, resourceful, reliable, and who give their industry a good name. The people who, when you’re asked what it takes to be a really excellent courier, immediately spring to mind."

    The questioning format is unashamedly nicked pretty much piecemeal from here.

    The mis-credit on the Landscape piece I take responsibility for, it was very careless of me not to provide the correct credits for the photos provided and I apologise for that.

    @ robnoxious I swiped that photo from Seamus's facebook after asking him, there was no name attributed to it so I assumed that was ok. Wicked pic btw. Hope that's cool..
  20.  
    yeah dazzler , no worries ,saying about the 20 questions, way way back in the day when MT was still a paper zine bill did them , i remember one for nixon and for von,its gota be more than 10 years ago i think ?
    keep up the good work folks :cool:

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